proof of (the existence of) god..................

[SHATOUSHKA]

when the topic of PI (not the movie) came up, this old thought came into my head.
i know i have posted this elsewhere, but i cannot (and will not) attempt to find it.

sooooooooooooooo.............

i am starting a new(er) topic on this subject.
-----------------------------------------------------------------


for many years i have held countless conversations with various people concerning the existence of god.
(lets not dissern WHO or WHAT god may be to you--lets keep this topic to the real topic)

no matter who believes what (and yes, sapius, this means you and C&E), i used to end all conversations with the same dilemma.

assuming 'god' is some 'supreme force' or 'higher power'(in terms of creation/ing)...even Nature, i have always held contempt for such nonsense.

-------------------------------------------------------------------
my famous question (dilemma):

'if you believe in (a) god, then there should be some evidence of (his/the) existence in nature.
show me the existence of a perfect circle and i will believe in (a) god.'
-------------------------------------------------------------------

naturally people will argue this and that about blah blah blah...and never get around to actually proving such a simple request.
often i suggest to them to seek (the) answer(s) in nature, since, in myprofessional, medical opinion, that is where a perfect circle is to be found: either in outer, inner, or present space.


------------------------------------------------------------------
how this relates to PI:

PI is not concrete evidence of a perfect circle. i would argue that it is an argument AGAINST a perfect circle.
i do not belive that anything is infinite and thusly, in my mind, PI is not infinite either. if anything, we have yet to discover the 'end' (--allowing such a thing exists).
------------------------------------------------------------------

if anyone here can answer my dilemma, i dare you to do so. in fact, i want you to amaze me.
what i want is evidence. this means that you may have to research support to your argument.
what i do not want is some BS posts spinning off of this tangent.

i am VERY interested in this subject.
i have always been so.
if you have an opinion or an idea, i would like to hear it.
honestly.

no jokes.
this is serious.




------------------
General Philosophy

[vecteur d'etat]

Humbly asking: what is PI?

------------------

[empiricyst]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SHATOUSHKA:
my famous question (dilemma):

'if you believe in (a) god, then there should be some evidence of (his/the) existence in nature. show me the existence of a perfect circle and i will believe in (a) god.'<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Of course perfect circles exist! They exist in the formal geometric definition of a circle, or are you saying ideas don't exist? There's certainly no such thing as a perfect empirical circle, for a couple of reasons, one being the limitations and uncertainty of empirical measurement and another being that existence is not static.


The Cyst

[empiricyst]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by vecteur d'etat:
Humbly asking: what is PI?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hehe, humble Pi! That's pretty funny!

The Cyst

[ek3]

I am going to interject my thoughts on this subject. This is not necessarily to sway you one-way or the other, but simply for conversation reasons.

I don't understand what it is you are looking for. Do you want to look at a beautiful sunset and see god's signature at the bottom? If you are looking for undeniable truth of the existence of god...good luck. I doubt you will ever find it. Religion is based on faith...If it didn't require faith to believe in a god, if there were undeniable truth, would it still be considered believing?

Religion is kind of like being blind. Being able to see, we know that the sky is blue and the grass is green, but a blind man doesn't. He has to use his imagination from what he hears and has been told. This is why I think there are so many interpretations on religion. If a person were able to compare two blind men's perception of this world, I doubt very highly that they would have any similarities. In the same sense, two people can read the Bible and get two totally different meanings.

Well...I kind of got off on a different tangent there. Let me re-focus.

I guess what I'm trying to say, is belief in God is based completely on faith...if there was undeniable truth, everyone would believe. There would be no religions, or different beliefs or theories on the origin of man. There would simply be the truth.

I'll try to re-think this and maybe write a more comprehendible version.


------------------
"He called the shit, poop!" - Billy Madison

[This message has been edited by ek3 (edited September 28, 2001).]

[Sapius]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Shatoush: often i suggest to them to seek (the) answer(s) in nature, since, in my professional, medical opinion, that is where a perfect circle is to be found: either in outer, inner, or present space.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Perfect circle? By the above statement, if you are directing people to seek a perfect circle in nature, goes to show that you have already seen and known it. I would like you to tell me, how is it done? and how could you show me?

..and what is this either outer? either inner? or either present "space"? I do not understand it.

and as ek3 puts it....
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I don't understand what it is you are looking for.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
....me too.

------------------
....just IMHO though.

[This message has been edited by Sapius (edited September 28, 2001).]

[SHATOUSHKA]

tastingood-- cute answer...but no quite perfect.

ek3-- not really sure what you are relating your post to--but i am curious of what you are getting at.

sapius-- i have yet to see a perfect circle.

what i am looking for is somewhere close to what (the so-called) empiricyst is describing.

vecteur d'etat-- i like the way you are thinking...




------------------
General Philosophy

[Hannibal]

Please explain a smidge further on exactly what your looking for. hmmm... not so much example persay, just a question. Hit it on the head. I'm not sure what you want.

------------------
As miserable as life may be I hold it pretty precious...

If I lose the light of the sun, I will write by candlelight, moonlight, no light. If I lose paper and ink, I wil write in blood on forgotten walls. I will write always, I will capture nights all over the world and bring them to you.

[TastinGood]

I have found the perfect circle!

All you must do to see it is go into 'paint'. Click on the circle tool and then just click and drag while holding shift!!! A perfect circle!!



------------------
"If Lincoln had thought being the President was such a longshot, we'd have nobody's picture on the one dollar bill" -Arthur Fonzerelli (The Fonz)

[empiricyst]

God is either everything, and, therefore, Nature, or God is some some finite entity subject to the laws of causality like you and me.

The question is: do you know what it means to be subject to the laws of causality?

What does Causality mean?

Oh my God!!!!!!!

What have I begun?????

The...oooozzzing Cyst